First Published: 18 January 2025
After writing yesterday’s musing, a friend asked what the daily needs of each phytonutrient are. Unfortunately, that doesn’t seem like an easy to answer question, since the textbook I’ve been relying on lists vitamins, not phytonutrients. It has, however, been updated in part, though tragically only for total energy expenditure. Time to see what Big Food1 thinks that I need.
Ooh! Equations with the actual R2 and RMSE2. Apparently men tend to need 10.83 fewer calories a year after the age of 193, regardless of physical activity. I do find it really interesting how very different the four levels of activity look for the caloric needs. Height is least important for Active men, and almost twice as important for very active men as anyone else. Weight also increases caloric needs as activity rises, which is fun. Anyways, I should apparently be shooting4 for between 3200 and 4200, depending on how active I am. It’s interesting how much of a jump there is between active and very active, though. That’s all from this book, so now to go through the 2006 book.
Exercise5: 60 minutes daily briskly walking or jogging at 3-4 miles per hour. I don’t consider that a brisk walking pace, since it’s a 15 to 20 minute mile but.
OOH! They go into detail about how to figure out your activity level, which is only designed for normal BMI6:
For PAL defined as the caloric intake divided by basal energy expenditure9 They go through a list of activities with the amount it is expected to change PAL per hour performed10. Billiards is apparently worth between 0.05 and 0.1 PAL per hour, meaning that 4 hours of billiards is almost enough to bring someone out of a sedentary life if that’s their only movement.
Walking at the pace they mention above is worth between .13 and .22 PAL per hour11
Carbs: have done before: 130 g/day for everyone over the age of 1 who is not pregnant. Needed to prevent ketosis and keep brain happy.
Fiber: Intake is based on caloric intake, which is kind of fun. If under one, no data exists.12 Otherwise, 14 grams per 1000 calories consumed is the expected need, though it’s not well proven. Dietary fiber is plant matter we can’t digest, and Functional fiber is additives.
Because we can’t measure things that aren’t absorbed, difficult to get good data. Ooh they break down the different forms of fiber by their effect. I’ll list the ones I find most interesting:
Guar gum can reduce blood cholesterol by 11-16 percent, along with significant reduction in glycemic response13
Oat products are more easily fermented.
The value comes from optimal intake to prevent heart disease. 42 to 56 grams a day isn’t that hard to hit at all
Fat, as before, pretty easy to hit
Cholesterol: your body can make it, so don’t need to eat it. Eating any makes you more likely to have chronic heart disease, and is found in animal products.
Protein as before, and is still broken down into the various amino acids.
Water: 3.7 L total consumption is apparently the average for men 19 to 70. That’s not super helpful for me, and I think I should shoot higher.
Woo Vitamins!
Vitamin A: 900 micrograms, and under 3000 micrograms. It’s measured in retinol activity, and one gram retinol is worth 12 grams of beta carotene or 24 grams of alpha carotene or beta cryptothanxin. Retinol is found in animal products, so the precursors are mostly needed for vegetarians. Recommended amount based on liver stores.
B6: 1.3 mg, under 100.14 Upper range causes neuropathy. Minimum is set by some fancy biology word. It’s about 75 percent bioavailable from a mixed diet, and comes from starchy vegetables, organ meat, non citrus fruit, and fortified cereal.
B12: 2.4 mg.
Biotin 30 ug, apparently we don’t know how the body processes it when bound to protein. Needed for carboxylation
Vitamin C: 90 to 2000 mg15. Only issue with too much is diarrhea, and smokers need more.
Carotenoids: Natural pigments, like beta carotene. Wildly, raw carrot absorption of beta carotene can be as bad as 5 percent, fruits are better, and supplements can go up to 70 percent. Steaming improves bioavailability, but prolonged cooking can make it worse. Needs to be consumed with fat for optimal intake.
Choline: 550 to 3500 mg. Mostly comes from membranes in foods: milk, liver, egg, peanut. Lethicin is apparently a supplement added for it.
D: 5 to 50 ug. Too much apparently causes too much calcium in blood
E: 15 to 1000 mg. Prevents free radicals, occurs in 8 forms, but plasma only maintains one. Upper limit because of hemorrhages. Vegetable oils have it, no one in America tends to be deficient unless body can’t intake. Apparently no specific metabolic roles.
Folate: 400 to 1000 ug. Comes from dark green vegetables, beans, legumes. Metabolizes16 nucleic and amino acids. UL defined because it can mask a B12 deficiency.
K: 120 ug. Blood coagulation and bone metabolism. Green vegetables17 and vegetable oils are the normal sources.
Niacin: 16 to 35 mg. Too high, flushing. Comes from meat or fortification. Insufficient B6, riboflavin, or iron may increase needs. If insufficient, causes pellagra.
Pantothenic Acid: 5 mg. Unknown how we get it, looks like less processed food better.18
Riboflavin: 1.3 mg. B219. Found in milk, bread, and20 fortified foods. Needed for redox reactions. Apparently no adverse upper level effects have been found. General malaise symptoms21 are deficiency signs.
Thiamin: 1.2 mg. B1! Metabolizes carbs and branched amino acids. We get it from fortified foods and ham. Anorexia and weight loss are symptoms of not enough. Also causes beriberi.
Elements: It goes through: Calcium22, the bone maker, Chromium23, which lets insulin work, Copper24, for molecular oxygen reduction, Fluoride25 for teeth and bone, Iodine26 for the thyroid27, Magnesium28 shows up all over the place in enzymatic things, Iron29 for hemoglobin, Manganese30,31 helps with bone making, Molybdenum32 as a cofactor,33, Phosphorus34,35 in Phosphate, for bone construction, Potassium36 for proper signaling, effects dependent on its anion, and it helps prevent NaCl from hurting us, Selenium37 prevents oxidative stress and helps redox C, too much causes brittle hair and nails, NaCl38 to keep our body like the sea, Sulfate39 comes from amino acid, Zinc40 which makes us grow, and (Arsenic, Boron, Nickel, Silicon, Vanadium)41, made a note that these elements might be needed for something, but not usually.
I do also have a new favorite quote from the day: “data were insufficient to set a UL42 for arsenic. Although a UL was not determined for arsenic, there is no justification fro adding it to food or supplements” Interestingly: organic arsenic is usually fine. Inorganic arsenic (arsenite III or arsenate V), by contrast, “is an established human poison”.
So, what have we learned?
Dietary science is a lot of “people who eat like this tend to do better”, and I remember seeing a thing about how the way food is presented affects absorption of nutrients. It makes me feel better that I cannot fall into the trap of living my life by evidence based practice to the detriment of my day to day living, because there truly is not a lot of evidence.43 Well, this has been a fun journey. Tune in next time to see my recipe for bread44
A friend, upon reading yesterday’s musing, asked a very poignant question: how much of each phytonutrient do I actually need? Using our favorite textbook, we find that the actual chemicals are not listed, instead the vitamins are.
lycopene is apparently not essential.
beta cryptothanxin converts to Vitamin A at a 24 to 1 efficiency, so in order to get the 900 micrograms a day I need, I need to consume 21.6 milligrams. Interestingly, ://tools.myfooddata.com/nutrient-ranking-tool/beta-carotene/all/highest/household/common/nomyfooddata tells me that carrots contain no beta cryptothanxin. One carrot does, however, contain about 6 milligrams of beta carotene, which is equivalent to half a mig45 of Retinol46, so two carrots a day47 is large enough, even if I have no other sources.
sulforaphane, isothiocyanates, and indoles
anthocyanins
alicin
Instead of trusting the website that told me I need pretty colors, I’m actually just going to take this time and see what nutrients the government thinks that I need daily.48
Vitamin A: 900 micrograms49
Vitamin C: 90 milligrams
Vitamin D: insufficient research, recommendation is 5 micrograms
Vitamin E: 15 milligrams
Vitamin K: insufficient research, recommendation 120 micrograms
Thiamin: 1.2 mg
Riboflavin: 1.3 mg
Niacin: 16 mg
Vitamin B6: 1.3 mg50
Folate: 400 micrograms
Vitamin B12: 2.4 micrograms
Pantothenic Acid: insufficient research, recommend 5 mg
Biotin: Insufficient research, recommend 30 micrograms
Choline: IR51, 550 mg
Calcium IR: 1000 mg52
Chromium53: IR, 35 micrograms
Copper: 900 ug54
Fluoride: IR, 4 mg
Iodine: 150 ug
Magnesium: 410 mg
Manganese: IR 2.3 mg
Molybdenum: 45 ug
Phosphorus: 700 mg
Selenium: 55 ug
Zinc: 11 mg
Potassium: IR 4.7 g55
Sodium: IR 1.5 g
Chloride:56 IR 2.3 g
Water: IR57, interestingly is not weight based. If I consume more than 0.7 to 1 liter per hour of it, I might get toxicity.
Welp, time to go back and see what the USDA cares enough about to write a chapter on.
one of the rare times I use this phrase where it’s accurate↩
about 340 cals↩
and women require 7 fewer↩
I’ll look at all four values, knowing that the very active will likely never be relevant again, even if the top three might be↩
which feels weird to put in dietary reference but↩
which does explain why they updated it↩
so curious what sub 1 is↩
what about above that!↩
I think that’s the assume you don’t move at all↩
which I love as a concept, thinking about the fact that your basal needs are the entire basis for the increased costs↩
this is a dangerous concept for me to be aware of, if only because I can start actually counting my movement in a variety of ways↩
which makes sense, because I don’t tend to think of milk as fibrous↩
which I assume is good↩
wow that’s a range↩
I have absolutely taken more than that↩
originally had an s (a s?) instead of z↩
tragically, mostly brassicas↩
the latter half of the sentence is commentary↩
so many b vitamins↩
as is becoming a trend,↩
commentary↩
1000 to 2500 mg↩
35 ug, estimated bc IR↩
900 to 10000 ug↩
IR, 4-10 mg↩
150 to 1100 ug↩
I knew this one! Comes from the soil which is why the Great Lakes are not healthy↩
410 mg, UL of 350, which is apparently only from pharmacological agents. Kind of funny still↩
8 to 45 mg, one of the rare cases where women have a higher one, and a significant one at that (18 mg)↩
I will always be mad that this and Magnesium are both elements↩
IR 2.3 to 11 mg↩
45 to 2000 ug↩
upper limits cause reproductive issues in mice, not people, it comes from the soil↩
mmmm matches↩
700 to 4000 mg↩
IR, 4.7 g↩
I never would have thought that I needed this, 55 to 400 ug↩
IR, 1.5 to 2.3 g Na, 2.3 to 3.6 g Cl↩
I do have to wonder why Phosphate wasn’t listed but↩
11 to 40 mg↩
all UL and mg/day, B: 20, Ni: 1, V: 1.8↩
upper limit↩
in the sense that like if I do the generally normally accepted advice of “eat less processed food, lots of plant, and move around more”, I’ll probably be fine↩
and a review!↩
since I say mig I type mig, instead of mg↩
read: Vitamin A↩
assuming a seven to eight inch carrot↩
these numbers are for males aged 19-30, but don’t really change a lot if you change that↩
no weight↩
the first one I’ve noticed increases as I grow older after 30. I wonder why↩
typing insufficient research is hard, so I’m just abbreviating here on out↩
how that differs from a gram, unsure↩
Wild, I had no idea I was actually supposed to have any↩
I hate typing microgram, and mu is not a latin letter, so I use its closest analog↩
wow such a big number↩
I wonder if there’s really any dietary source for chlorine outside of salt↩
OH NO! I’ve learned that this is just normal data. I’ll have to look at each chapter for the weight based things↩