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The End of a Series

First Published: 18 January 2025

Draft 2

After writing yesterday’s musing, a friend asked what the daily needs of each phytonutrient are. Unfortunately, that doesn’t seem like an easy to answer question, since the textbook I’ve been relying on lists vitamins, not phytonutrients. It has, however, been updated in part, though tragically only for total energy expenditure. Time to see what Big Food1 thinks that I need.

I do also have a new favorite quote from the day: “data were insufficient to set a UL42 for arsenic. Although a UL was not determined for arsenic, there is no justification fro adding it to food or supplements” Interestingly: organic arsenic is usually fine. Inorganic arsenic (arsenite III or arsenate V), by contrast, “is an established human poison”.

So, what have we learned?

Dietary science is a lot of “people who eat like this tend to do better”, and I remember seeing a thing about how the way food is presented affects absorption of nutrients. It makes me feel better that I cannot fall into the trap of living my life by evidence based practice to the detriment of my day to day living, because there truly is not a lot of evidence.43 Well, this has been a fun journey. Tune in next time to see my recipe for bread44

Draft 1

A friend, upon reading yesterday’s musing, asked a very poignant question: how much of each phytonutrient do I actually need? Using our favorite textbook, we find that the actual chemicals are not listed, instead the vitamins are.

Instead of trusting the website that told me I need pretty colors, I’m actually just going to take this time and see what nutrients the government thinks that I need daily.48

Welp, time to go back and see what the USDA cares enough about to write a chapter on.


  1. one of the rare times I use this phrase where it’s accurate↩

  2. about 340 cals↩

  3. and women require 7 fewer↩

  4. I’ll look at all four values, knowing that the very active will likely never be relevant again, even if the top three might be↩

  5. which feels weird to put in dietary reference but↩

  6. which does explain why they updated it↩

  7. so curious what sub 1 is↩

  8. what about above that!↩

  9. I think that’s the assume you don’t move at all↩

  10. which I love as a concept, thinking about the fact that your basal needs are the entire basis for the increased costs↩

  11. this is a dangerous concept for me to be aware of, if only because I can start actually counting my movement in a variety of ways↩

  12. which makes sense, because I don’t tend to think of milk as fibrous↩

  13. which I assume is good↩

  14. wow that’s a range↩

  15. I have absolutely taken more than that↩

  16. originally had an s (a s?) instead of z↩

  17. tragically, mostly brassicas↩

  18. the latter half of the sentence is commentary↩

  19. so many b vitamins↩

  20. as is becoming a trend,↩

  21. commentary↩

  22. 1000 to 2500 mg↩

  23. 35 ug, estimated bc IR↩

  24. 900 to 10000 ug↩

  25. IR, 4-10 mg↩

  26. 150 to 1100 ug↩

  27. I knew this one! Comes from the soil which is why the Great Lakes are not healthy↩

  28. 410 mg, UL of 350, which is apparently only from pharmacological agents. Kind of funny still↩

  29. 8 to 45 mg, one of the rare cases where women have a higher one, and a significant one at that (18 mg)↩

  30. I will always be mad that this and Magnesium are both elements↩

  31. IR 2.3 to 11 mg↩

  32. 45 to 2000 ug↩

  33. upper limits cause reproductive issues in mice, not people, it comes from the soil↩

  34. mmmm matches↩

  35. 700 to 4000 mg↩

  36. IR, 4.7 g↩

  37. I never would have thought that I needed this, 55 to 400 ug↩

  38. IR, 1.5 to 2.3 g Na, 2.3 to 3.6 g Cl↩

  39. I do have to wonder why Phosphate wasn’t listed but↩

  40. 11 to 40 mg↩

  41. all UL and mg/day, B: 20, Ni: 1, V: 1.8↩

  42. upper limit↩

  43. in the sense that like if I do the generally normally accepted advice of “eat less processed food, lots of plant, and move around more”, I’ll probably be fine↩

  44. and a review!↩

  45. since I say mig I type mig, instead of mg↩

  46. read: Vitamin A↩

  47. assuming a seven to eight inch carrot↩

  48. these numbers are for males aged 19-30, but don’t really change a lot if you change that↩

  49. no weight↩

  50. the first one I’ve noticed increases as I grow older after 30. I wonder why↩

  51. typing insufficient research is hard, so I’m just abbreviating here on out↩

  52. how that differs from a gram, unsure↩

  53. Wild, I had no idea I was actually supposed to have any↩

  54. I hate typing microgram, and mu is not a latin letter, so I use its closest analog↩

  55. wow such a big number↩

  56. I wonder if there’s really any dietary source for chlorine outside of salt↩

  57. OH NO! I’ve learned that this is just normal data. I’ll have to look at each chapter for the weight based things↩